Thread: Democracy/ Communism

there's no place like home *click*... there's no place like home *click*... there's no place like home *click*...

too bad. we're stuck in Oz.

they didn't come with that little packet with all the extra sequins and thread and shit? lame! I can even dye my eyes to match my gown! aha!

there's no place like home *click*... there's no place like home *click*... there's no place like home *click*...

too bad. we're stuck in Oz.
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That we are. Flying monkeys and all...

A TRUE Democracy is the greatest thing in the world, but today, it is a pipedream. No true democracy can survive because once the populace learns that they can vote themselves more social programs it becomes first a socialist state and eventually the government collapses to be reformed into something else. [/b]

Goddamned populace, wanting social saftey nets, healthcare and other bullshit like that!

People are fine, its when the flying monkeys get the vote it all goes wrong.

meh. i don't know anything about democracy, communism or socialsim. edward, would you care to give me a reasnobly indepth description of what they are, their pros and cons please? no doubt you wont mind as you started a topic to discuss these things. (i apologise, but im FAR too lazy to find stuff out for myself)

Moreover define 'work'.

What is the point of a political system? To make as many people happy as possible? To enable as far as possible the pursuit of knowledge towards the metaphysical truth(s) of our existance?

Has there ever been a democracy or a communist state? After all not even Athens enabled 'total' democracy, nor did the Soviet Union ever fully become Communist. Stalin admitted the failure of the communist ideal when he annouced the socialism in one state strategy.

And what theories?

Communism varies heavily from author to author. A Marxist-Leninisism is, for instance vastly different to Trotskyist ideas in the process that one goes through to reach the final communist state. Even if though both seek, ultimately, the same end. In either case the Soviet attempt at communism worked well enough to produce a state capable of defeating the Nazis. (before you Yanks get on your high horses - 90% of German casualties in the second world war were sustained on the Eastern front, even if America economically aided the Soviets.) Even if they then colonised Eastern Europe pretty brutally, at least they prevented the completion of the final solution.

The present Us and UK are not democracies: they are elected aristocracies/oligarchies in which we are given considerable civil liberties. (as Aristotle pointed out - elections are aristocratic not democratic. they produce an elite who govern, supposedly, in the interests of the people, but the people only exercise any real political power at elections. See the 1m people marching vs. Iraq war = war anyway) If we lived in a true democracy we would have a state in which referendums would be held on every decision taken in parliament. The people would rule.


So yeah. Political systems aren't simple.But i would say the Uk system at least provides basic health and educational welfare to all citizens. Which is considerable progress from the early 19thc.

The present Us and UK are not democracies: they are elected aristocracies/oligarchies in which we are given considerable civil liberties. (as Aristotle pointed out - elections are aristocratic not democratic. they produce an elite who govern, supposedly, in the interests of the people, but the people only exercise any real political power at elections. See the 1m people marching vs. Iraq war = war anyway) If we lived in a true democracy we would have a state in which referendums would be held on every decision taken in parliament. The people would rule.
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Right on my brother from another mother!

UK = Constitutional Monarchy => Democracy
US = Constitutional Federal Republic => Democracy

What's the difference?
The UK is overtly controlled by an aristocratic elite, meaning that all Commonwealth citizens are well aware, and therefore can more easily accept, that a royal family is sovereign.
The US is covertly controlled by an aristocratic elite, meaning that we are merely led to believe that The People are sovereign of this nation, exemplified by our right to vote, when in reality it is run behind the scenes by an elite oligarchy.

Ultimately, the true rulers of this world are the bankers; those who extend endless amounts of credit to ALL nations regardless of the type of government. The United States has been bankrupt since 1933, make of that what you will.