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Thread: Relativity of "Evil"

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    We're starting a new unit in my Honors English class this week, on the Holocaust. During the course, we will be reading the book, The Night, and we're doing a journal on each chapter as we read it.

    The pre-reading journal entry was, "Why do you think evil exists in the world?" I, as always, had the 'different' view. I wrote on why you need to define the word before actually applying it. I stated that "the word can denote anything from the consumption of a slaughtered cow contained in a McDonald's burger patty to the President's proposal of an amendment to ban gay marriage. The word can recognize a cartoon character in a video game, like Bowser, from Super Mario, as well as real world political figures, especcially political enemies, like Iraqi Hussein is to many Americans."

    I kept on writing until it was almost a page in length. I talked about how for many people religion is a vital role in their early development of what good and evil may be. Devil, even has the word, "Evil" in it.

    I went on to saying that "I don't beleive that there is or that there ever has been evil. Hitler has been portrayed as the epitomy of a hell's beast, be he was firm in his beleifs, and fought for them. He truly beleived in the superiority of the Aryan race, and he did anything he could to make sure that they would previal, and although I don't agree with it at all, I wouldn't go so far as to hating him. Some people have come accross the idea that maybe he was under the influence of a drug. This drug could have cut off his perception of reality.

    "I don't think that anyone blessed with the white angel on one shoulder could be portrayed as demonic. Unless, of course, the person is impaired. Ever matter is a controvery and so people will have the tendency to choose either side. People on both sides have thier reasons. They do what they think is right, what is true, and what is virteous. To imply evil would require an alien figure that reserves itself from the laws of nature and morality.

    "Why does evil exist in the world? - Because people fail to consider the oppontents views equal to their own."


    In class today, we started to talk about it. I let about half the people in the class share their views, and they all talked about the Adam and Eve apple and how evil is an entity that was once released into the world, and now is to stay forever. I really didn't have any input there, being atheist, and so I waited some more. People kept on talking about why evil is here, like the prompt asked, but nobody really even touched the topic of what evil is. Sure, some people mentioned the genocide, that that was about it.

    And so I raised my hand, and got my chance to speak. I told them all how I didn't beleive that there weren't any criterion for the word, and that it could mean a large variety of things. But people really didn't seem to agree. They tried to project their opinion on me, about how the killing of a human life is evil, but I couldn't really agree with it at all. I mean, to me, death is nothing, and life is only the prerequisite to death.

    I can't understand how all of them will say that death is wrong and how some of them will stand up for pro choice. I told them how a week ago, I would have debated someone anti-choice into the ground, but now that I'm developing different types of views, that maybe they actually have a point. I mean, I never before put myself into the shoes of a boyfriend whose partner wanted to have an abortion. What if I was the one that wanted the baby?

    In short, what I'm asking here is: Is evil a generic term to define the unfavorable, or does it exist in actuality?

    Down with the esquires.

    Gaurav . My Journal . My Profile

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    If there were no higher being who could define evil, then it would be all in perception.
    I'd was going to create a very strongly constructed argument against your position; but then I got high.
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    So you're saying that the only reason I feel this way is because I'm atheist?

    Down with the esquires.

    Gaurav . My Journal . My Profile

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    Originally posted by Carolyn@Nov 4 2004, 11:56 AM
    If there were no higher being who could define evil, then it would be all in perception.
    <div align="right"><{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    [/quote]
    Well, since no higher being has come to define evil, I think your quite right. It is all in perception. Thats a lot of what Biocrite was saying. People develop a moral stand point, which sets up their views of good and evil.


    Death. Now there is a good example. Its a popular belief that death is evil, which seems to make sense. It hurts when people around us die. We hold on to people we care about and don&#39;t want to let go. But death itsself is not evil. People need to be able to die. It is in man&#39;s nature to die. Just like every good song, every good life must come to an end, and that is not a bad thing. Death is a provider of food, a liberator of space, and a reconciliation between man and nature.

    Now, my morally developed stand point is that things that try to go against nature are evil. I&#39;m not talking trees-and-flowers nature, I&#39;m talking about the way things are. Nature is something&#39;s default state of being, how it unconscously strives to be. So therefore, I think both life and death are good. Thats just where I&#39;m coming from.
    "There is a significant similarity between fighting and funerals.
    Just as the slaughter of many people should be accompanied by weeping and mourning,
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    I guess your explanation kind of goes hand in hand with why they think killing is evil as well. By killing, a person dies, and through that death, people feel greif. And so they blame the killer, because death is a false entity.

    I can understand that much, but I mean, in class, they all attacked me verbally, even the teacher, and today I was called a sociopath. I mean, I gave them my two cents, but they didn&#39;t take them, and I really can&#39;t understand why. I mean, don&#39;t I have a point?:

    Evil is what you want it to be, and accepting that everything has a reason, and that every wrong was caused by impairment IS defeating evil.

    I mean I don&#39;t find Hitler evil at all. Look at it from his point of view; he thought that the Jews were dangerous and so he enacted a plan to stop them. Whether or not he was right is not the point - nobody I know around here would go as far as to call Bush evil for starting the war. I&#39;m pretty sure even he&#39;d admit that it was a bad decision, and if Hitler was here now, with the same intelligence that we have, don&#39;t you think he might think twice as well?

    Down with the esquires.

    Gaurav . My Journal . My Profile

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    You&#39;re all missing the point. You want everything to fit into the reality you are members of but when you do this to good and evil you are left only with precived action and reaction. This leaves you with false impressions. One can be benevolent of malevolent. Some will do what they can to help whilst others will cause pain. Reason is only a preception, the Truth comes from their mind&#39;s thought towards the world and the members of their reality.
    Inspirational quote on individuality #223: "Lately everyone I know/ has been shittin&#39; all over me/ Hey you, and all of my good friends/ They disowned my fucking friends and me/ I guess it&#39;s because/ I gotta go off in my little own direction/ But fuck &#39;em all. I&#39;ll never follow./ They can suck on my erection." - Mr. GG Allin

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    Evil is just this thing ideology people have created as a form of social control.

    There are many interpertations of evil existing throughout different cultures though the interpertations are generally similar. Evil is the threat(perhaps even only the percieved threat in many situations) of being ostracized for acting in a way harmful(not only physically, but also as a challenge to the ideological mindset people hold so dearly, often blindly) to others.

    Though to an extent social control in beneficial to the average human(but not everybody) as some loss of freedom in exchange for some protection, being an especially handy asset to those in positions of power able to condemn actions unfit to thier agenda as evil.
    You and I together in our lives
    Sacred ties would never fray
    Then why can&#39;t I let myself tell lies
    And watch you die every day

    Is it all just wasted time
    Can you look at yourself
    When you think of what
    You left behind...

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    Evil is in the eye of the beholder, so unless God comes down and specifically defines what is evil or not, then its just a case of making it up ourselves.

    I also had a long post on the &#39;evilness&#39; of abortions, but the computer ate it, which is a bugger.
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Saint @ Oct 9 2008, 05:38 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
    You can probably set her straight with a GOOD HOT DICKING.

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    Originally posted by biocrite@Nov 4 2004, 03:30 PM
    So you&#39;re saying that the only reason I feel this way is because I&#39;m atheist?
    <div align="right"><{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    [/quote]

    I&#39;m saying that logically, if there was no God then there could be no definition of evil. If there is a creator then he gets to make the rules.
    I&#39;d was going to create a very strongly constructed argument against your position; but then I got high.
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  10. #10
    my cows
    Originally posted by Carolyn+Nov 5 2004, 09:54 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Carolyn @ Nov 5 2004, 09:54 AM)</div>
    <!--QuoteBegin-biocrite
    @Nov 4 2004, 03:30 PM
    So you&#39;re saying that the only reason I feel this way is because I&#39;m atheist?
    <div align="right"><{POST_SNAPBACK}>
    I&#39;m saying that logically, if there was no God then there could be no definition of evil. If there is a creator then he gets to make the rules.
    <div align="right"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
    [/b][/quote]

    This is implying that people can&#39;t possibly be intelligent enough to know good from evil without God. I disagree.

    There have been cultures in the world that are without God and they certainly know good from evil.

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    anything on this earth can be seen as evil if you look at it the right way. white people are evil, black people, asians, computers, tv&#39;s, killings, birth, hell even rastafarians. evil is not a thing. its a thought process.

    if you understand that i congradulate you.
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  12. #12
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    My two cents, delivered in a somewhat off topic way...

    Biocrite, I had a very similar experience in my english class my senior year. The discussion was about Hitler, Nazis and evil. My perspective was, and still is, that it&#39;s very hard to just pin evil on one group.

    How can one lay the totality of the blame at the feet of Hitler and the Nazis for the suffering of the holocaust? It&#39;s not like the Allies of WWI didn&#39;t play an integral part in pushing Germany to the brink of that movement. We weren&#39;t there when one could take a wheelbarrow full of money, stand in line for hours and still not get the loaf of bread to feed their family to save them from starvation. I have often thought that Hitler and Nazi Germany were the scapegoats. Unfortunately I can&#39;t say that we&#39;ve learned from that experience. It&#39;s something that people still do to this day.

    How can a person, nation or idea be called evil and the people that directly influenced the development of that person, nation or idea be called good?

    Perspectives are a powerful defining element in good and evil.


    I have two thoughts on evil as an entity.

    One, I&#39;ll agree with Vulture that evil is going against nature. Nature is one absolute that can&#39;t be argued with. On a global scale, evil is being demonstrated in every facet of life just about. Our minds are structured to be largely dependent upon reason as opposed to instinct. But is instinct always good? Hard to say, it&#39;s not like the monkeys don&#39;t go to "war". But at least they&#39;re fighting for their lives and territory, not for some arbitrary set of ideologies.

    The second, is that evil is ignorance. Some people say that ignorance is bliss. But then the easy way out tends to be... well, easier. Heh.

    Thing is, while these two things seem contradictory, they really don&#39;t have to be. We as a species, are choosing to go against the systems of nature instead of with them. We haven&#39;t put forth our brains to make it a way of life to live within the bounds of nature. Perhaps someday we will. I can only hope.
    Your mind can only hold one thought at a time. Make it a positive and constructive one.
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